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Teaching attack last night... had a good size class, good energy.

get to track 6 and about halfway through, i start getting pretty embarresed about the program.

so many of the track 6's that we have (50 to present) are SO SIMILAR to each other, that its almost a joke.  its sad, and its embarrassing.  there are a few gems like 50, 55 and 62's, but those are few and far between.

This is the pretty much the format for EVERY track 6

Part1) run in a circle

Part 2) run to the middle clapping (the change release to release? clap 4 or 8 times)

Part 3)....(this is the only part of the song that really changes from release to release)  either pendulum swings, or some variations of knees

.................Repeat three times...................end by doing part 2 and a high knee run.

There you go.... i just wrote the chorey for the next track 6...

this is also a problem with track 8,  (See the Light, (A GREAT SONG!!!) is so repetitive and generic to track 8's its drepressing) and track 3's to be honest.  what is crazy is that Lisa is SO GOOD at mixing up the push up track, track 4's and conditioning tracks, that i know it can be done.  but for some reason the only thing new about many of the releases is the music( which is always awsome!)

Attack used to be as strong as any program at our gym but it is starting to slowly die.  My members say the love the class, the music and the moves, but there isnt much mystery with a new release... its always the same.

I enjoy attack alot... i love the energy, the workout, and the things it does for the body.  but I hate to say it.... i am thinking of stopping teaching.  mainly because i am getting ready to launch the same program i launched 3 years ago....just set to diff music.

Awwww, don't say that! It's clear you're frustrated, but take some time to sit back and reflect on your reasoning for wanting to drop the program.

First and foremost, ATTACK is, in my opinion, the most challenging of all the programs. Endurance, speed, power, agility, it's all in there. The instructors have to demonstrate such a superior level of fitness that it's inspiring just to see people like you at work.

I have to say that I don't particularly envy the Program Directors' position in creating fresh and fun choreography every three months. There's only so much you can do with a bar, your fists, a ball, even your body that in time, it becomes very challenging to incorporate new moves that are added not just for innovation's sake, but also because they're functional to the workout. Added to that is the fact that many of these programs have been around for years (some more than a decade) and you're hard pressed to keep things new.

I think that's why some of the programs have "morphed" somewhat over the years. The program itself isn't overhauled, but certain aspects to it are. Think COMBAT adding the capoeira-based moves and ATTACK some of the bootcamp-style drills. This goes a long way in helping keep things from becoming monotonous.

Please reconsider your statement.  Your profile demonstrates the qualities that I think Les Mills would like its instructors to embody- sheer passion for what you do. You may also want to BLAH your opinion and offer possible solutions. In the meantime, remember what brought you to ATTACK in the first place and try and revisit some of the releases that really inspired you.

im not sure how long you have been doing the program... but it is GREAT that you still love it the way it comes off in your post.  and it wasnt until 2 years into us having the program the numbers started falling or i started really feeling this way....... because the essence of the program is THAT GOOD.

 I agree that Attack is a superb workout.  thats why it killed me to write anything negative.  but you hit my point straight on the head... BC has morphed a bit.   the thing is that BC tracks from release to release may be similar... but rarely do they mirror each other so closely that that members know what is coming before I cue it.

Example.    next time you teach Attack track 6.... your running in a circle... you tell them to slow down...............      you dont even have to tell them whats next because they are already running to the center clapping.  THEY KNOW ITS COMING  ..........every pickin time.  no mystery.    after 3 years of doing the same chorey....  it gets embarresing.

and being a PD would be a HECK of a job.  very hard.....VERY.    but being a waitress and always putting on a happy face, no matter how hard your day is,  is hard too.....but we expect them to do it.  Im not saying that waiting tables is even in the same ballpark as being a PD, but this is the hard chore that they have.  keeping things fresh.

and i dont want an overhaul either.  55's 6 was AWSOME!!!!  just some spice.  im jazzed that lis did the latest track 7 like she did.  Great.    but the tracks that need something like that so badly are 3's 6 and 8's.  and it needs more than just the just a pendulum swing in place of where we have double knees normally.

 and.... thanks for the kind words

krafty:

so many of the track 6's that we have (50 to present) are SO SIMILAR to each other, that its almost a joke.  its sad, and its embarrassing.  there are a few gems like 50, 55 and 62's, but those are few and far between.

This is the pretty much the format for EVERY track 6

Part1) run in a circlei

Part 2) run to the middle clapping (the change release to release? clap 4 or 8 times)

Part 3)....(this is the only part of the song that really changes from release to release)  either pendulum swings, or some variations of knees

.................Repeat three times...................end by doing part 2 and a high knee run.

There you go.... i just wrote the chorey for the next track 6...

this is also a problem with track 8,  (See the Light, (A GREAT SONG!!!) is so repetitive and generic to track 8's its drepressing) and track 3's to be honest. 

I have to agree with thefitnessguy and credit to the LM team. I wouldn't like to create the chorey.

Track 6, yes it's typically the same most releases but what can you do in a running track but run? There you go - this shows the extent of my imagination when it comes to chorey. Can you do better krafty?

This is where the instructor comes in. You make it entertaining, motivating, exciting. Use the music the lyrics and create some of that fitness magic - it's not all in the chorey, chorey is only one of the 5 LM elements.

You are correct in spotting similar formuals in the moves and to some extent chorey, not just in track 6 or but all tracks. That said, attack 64 has some new stuff - superman hop, and of course "bootcamp" for example. The programme constantly evolves but not at such a pace as to make each release wildly different. Cast your mind back to a "classic" track 7 and you probably have to think way back to 47 and "Sweat" (Hairspray is not a classic! ). Now bootcamp has arrived the possibilities for track 7 have been blown wide open. So what will track 7 be like in 65? And will they revamp the running or interval tracks next? Who knows!

 

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BodyAttack - Everything else is just a warm up

have you taken the chance to BLAH your feedback directly on the releases?  Hear your concerns on chorey & think that's a great place to start.  Once you do that, have a look other surrounding factors that might have effected attendance and start action planning. 

would encourage you/GFM/owners to take a look at the numbers if they're definintely dropping off - go back in your attendance numbers to see where they started dropping.  Look at changes that happened starting then - any new programming coming in, losing popular instructors, new instructors who aren't up to "par", less focus on teaching options when needed etc. - see how clear of a picutre you can paint on everything that could effect your numbers.

 Have a simple chat w/ members who used to take BA regularly but who aren't taking it now - what changed?  was it in fact the chorey, was it injury due to poor technique, was it loss of the timeslot or instructor they wanted, did they have a schedule change personally, etc - find out where your former members are and why. 

Do you have a lot of new members who've come into the club since you've launched who haven't found success in the program?

 Finally - have a look at your instructor team.  Can you come together to up-skill each other - provide feedback & challenge to each other.  See how they're feeling about the program - action plan what you've found out by talking to your members.  Talk about what's exciting w/ the newest releases, and how you can inject excitement back into each other and the program - and the way you teach it. 

Change what you can - and provide feedback to LMI on the rest.  It's obvious you love the program (YAY!) - keep that coming through to the members!

 B

If the running tracks are boring, let's discuss what variation HAS appeared, and generate some ideas for the choreographers. There's one track with sideways runs that change to regular running. That's OK. The 180 degree 'turn and run out' has been used a couple of times recently.  We've also had the '4 corners' thing a couple of times, but the diagonal crossing is a collision risk, and the other one moving around from corner to corner is a joke. I don't like the 'line running' track (release 55?) as there's risk of collision with pillars in our gym and some don't like the sharp turning at each end.

So what have been the most innovative running tracks and how could these ideas be built on? What new ideas can people suggest that work in all shapes of studios (square, long, wide)?

There was an old running track, Layla, that was awesome and high energy. Anyone remember it? The choreographers could dig this out and rework the moves.

krafty:

im not sure how long you have been doing the program... but it is GREAT that you still love it the way it comes off in your post.  and it wasnt until 2 years into us having the program the numbers started falling or i started really feeling this way....... because the essence of the program is THAT GOOD.

 I agree that Attack is a superb workout.  thats why it killed me to write anything negative.  but you hit my point straight on the head... BC has morphed a bit.   the thing is that BC tracks from release to release may be similar... but rarely do they mirror each other so closely that that members know what is coming before I cue it.

Example.    next time you teach Attack track 6.... your running in a circle... you tell them to slow down...............      you dont even have to tell them whats next because they are already running to the center clapping.  THEY KNOW ITS COMING  ..........every pickin time.  no mystery.    after 3 years of doing the same chorey....  it gets embarresing.

and being a PD would be a HECK of a job.  very hard.....VERY.    but being a waitress and always putting on a happy face, no matter how hard your day is,  is hard too.....but we expect them to do it.  Im not saying that waiting tables is even in the same ballpark as being a PD, but this is the hard chore that they have.  keeping things fresh.

and i dont want an overhaul either.  55's 6 was AWSOME!!!!  just some spice.  im jazzed that lis did the latest track 7 like she did.  Great.    but the tracks that need something like that so badly are 3's 6 and 8's.  and it needs more than just the just a pendulum swing in place of where we have double knees normally.

 and.... thanks for the kind words

I agree. I used to do Attack as a participant for 2 years and I finally gave up on the programme because I found myself clock watching because although the workout is great, the chori was boring and repetative from release to release!

I do think though that this is why Attack works. There are quite a few people that just want a no-brainer class where you don't have to go away and practice techniques to get the workout right like you do in Combat sometimes (which I think is one of Combats strengths as it's a laster!). You can go straight into an Attack class and get an instant workout. Combat, you have to work at it for a few classes to get your tech sorted to get the correct workout.

I have had some participants in my Combat classes go to Attack also and some have stopped Combat to do Attack instead, but most of them have ended up coming back to Combat. Why? The same reasons I stopped doing Attack!

This is not meant to be a negative post against Attack as I really don't know what the choriographers can do to change chori without changing the style or feel of an Attack class that for most works fine!

Hmmm.   I would just like to volunteer the point of view of one particpant (moi)... I regularly come here and read the posts of instructors with interest, because I really like getting your point of view.  And what seems clear to me is that because of how intimately involved you are with these programs, with learning chorrey, refining your technique and (some people) teaching it several times a week, week-in, week-out... well, how to put it, I think maybe you end up "not seeing the wood for the trees" a bit, y'know?

OK so you may lose participants from any class or programme and there can be myriad reasons for it, but I bet your BA classes are generally filled with  enthusiastic, happy participants.  And I reckon of those people:

About 20% might be total newbies, or have only done a few classes, or just dip in & out casually from time to time, so aren't really all that familiar with the program and more than likely have no idea what's coming next at any given moment!

About 40% might be regulars or semi-regulars, but not especially "keen" BodyAttackers (ie., the people who come and do a couple of classes a week at the gym, take it fairly easy in the back row, it's not a major part of their life and they probably don't rant to friends & loved ones about how great BA is or try to drag them along...)

And the remaining 30% are probably the "hardcore" BA guys who come week in, week out and really love the program/ class.  And even within that group there's probably a mixture of people who just love any hardcore aerobic workout and don't particularly care if it's BA, and people for whom it just happens to fit their schedule exactly, and people who just like you in particular, and then lastly perhaps a handful of proper BA obsessives who probably fantasise about being instructors themselves one day... 

Anyway after all that: the point I'm trying to make is that even if a lot of the people in your class know what's coming next, it probably doesnt bug the vast majority of them anything like the way it bugs you.  (Mainly because they just don't have the same close & intimate relationship with the material that you do).  I bet the majority of them (most of the newbies, regulars, and even quite a lot of the "hardcore") are perfectly happy with BA the way it is and don't particularly want it to change, other than the odd "innovation" for a bit of variety & fun.  Essentially: if it ain't broke, people aren't going to want it fixed!

Speaking very specifically for myself:  I've been taking 2-3 BA classes a week for about 2 years and sure I know the format and I generally know more-or-less what's coming even on a new release... but that's fine with me!  I like it that way, because I know it works; I know the basic chorrey and how to executive the moves with good technique, and that leaves me free to push myself harder.  Frankly, track 6 has never been my favourite anyway, but it doesn't particularly bother me if it's much the same every time: it does the trick!  And actually, tracks 3 and 8 are usually my very favourite ones in any release!  I guess I enjoy simple, pared-down, repetitive moves; as I say, it gives me more scope to push the intensity.

when we first launched attack we had a number of instructors.... some good, some bad.  the program was new, and it was loved.  we already had BC and it was a strength.  BA rivaled it for a year at least.  we launched on 52 and bought back to 50.   it helped out our total GF # immensly.  and i believe it still does.  Helps round out the total program.

 But slowly attack numbers dimmed.  and BC kept growing.  NOW,  a full attack class is 30-40, and a full BC is 60-70 and we have to turn people away.  All of our Attack instructors also are our BC instructors, and most are more suited to teach Attack.  they probably teach that in the essence more easily.  But still the numbers dimmed.  and we do have the best GROUP  of instructor talent that ive seen at one gym....outside of NZ.

Gamedamsel you brought a great point to the table.  i like the way you broke down the %'s.  And i think Attack keeps the newbies coming back pretty well.  but once they become hardcore, they bore of the routine.  we dont keep as many poeple coming back when they have been coming for a year, for reason previously stated.  

sure some people may love the fact that its the same every time.  but MOST dont.  thats a fact.  otherwise the numbers would have stayed high.   People like variety.  not complete change, they do like to be familier, but they want a bit of spice.  If everyone liked the same thing again and again.... we would onlyneed one channel on TV and one resturaunt in town.    but we have more.

I have no doubt that Attack will stay fairly strong and will hold its own if no changes are made.  its a formula that works.  and it is a great workout.       .................But it could be sooooooo much BETTER!!!!!!!!!

you may say if its not broke dont fix it, but i guess that depends on what you think 'broke' is.  I think (although strong) its running on mediocre.  it has SO SO MUCH POTENTIAL.    with just a bit more, Attack could run like a farrari.....

Okay, I'm sorry. I have to (respectfully) disagree, for the most part. I do like that it switches up a little, but that things are similar. I like knowing approximately what I"m looking forward to, but not everything so that it kicks my body into gear.

 Track 3--not a Superman fan, but they do something for your hips and thighs! LOL! I'd like fewer, but okay, it's just part of Attack, right?

Track  6--often one of my favorites because I know at least this one I can do! LOL! Always!

Track 7--They switch this up pretty well, I think.

 Track 8--My most favorite in any release!! LOVE the high kicks!!!

Track 9--It's always a tough one for me. This last one with all the jumps was killer! (63! HATED the temper tantrum jumps!)

But anyway, as a participant who does this twice a week, I like that I know approximately what to expect because it helps me to know how much to put into each move, and not to watch the clock...I know just what tracks are left and how much energy I need to conserve! LOL!

 That's my view! :) 

Also, the better the teacher, the harder I work. :)

mellag:

 

But anyway, as a participant who does this twice a week, I like that I know approximately what to expect because it helps me to know how much to put into each move, and not to watch the clock...

Very true!!! - that's something that's been brought up during both trainings I've been to: participants know what to expect, whether they take the class in Manhattan or Tokyo. It's an individual experience shared on a global scale.

KRAFTY - i know exactly what you're talking about. i have been a BA instructor for almost a year now, and oftentimes, I have felt embarassed, depending on the release, such as the repetitive 7 on release 63, or 6, on release 63 as well. do you mix up the tracks quite a bit? the past few weeks i have been mixing up the tracks like crazy... we'll be launching 64 in a few weeks. i have been changing 6. right now, my fave is 62 bc of the corners, but i just wanted to say i completely understand. BA is our weakest program by far, and i don't know if it's bc of the chorey, or bc of the difficulty level (many people complain about their knees hurting). i feel like i'm the only instructor that puts a lot of work and effort into the program. we even downsized from 4 classes to 2 classes per week @ our gym :(. with that said, i really DO love Attack very much and am not going to give up. It's my favorite program and i'm going to try to keep it alive as much as i can!

GameDamsel:

Anyway after all that: the point I'm trying to make is that even if a lot of the people in your class know what's coming next, it probably doesnt bug the vast majority of them anything like the way it bugs you.  (Mainly because they just don't have the same close & intimate relationship with the material that you do).  I bet the majority of them (most of the newbies, regulars, and even quite a lot of the "hardcore") are perfectly happy with BA the way it is and don't particularly want it to change, other than the odd "innovation" for a bit of variety & fun.  Essentially: if it ain't broke, people aren't going to want it fixed!

Isn't this one of the great things about the Internet? As an instructor I think it's awesome to get real feedback like this from a participant, and I don't think it would happen in a real scenario in a gym. Thanks SO much for your insight this is great...

And I 100% agree with you that we instructors live and "breathe" the material, I mean how many times do you listen to the music or watch the DVD before you actually present it? Your participants don't! So sometimes it's good to remember that they don't have the same exposure to the program that we do...

Applies across the board to all programs, well stated GameDamsel!

aprileve411:

BA is our weakest program by far, and i don't know if it's bc of the chorey, or bc of the difficulty level (many people complain about their knees hurting).

Knee problems could be avoided by proper technique, options (lower impact on certain moves), good shoes and by attending a BA class max three times per week with a rest day in between.

thefitnessguy:

mellag:

 

But anyway, as a participant who does this twice a week, I like that I know approximately what to expect because it helps me to know how much to put into each move, and not to watch the clock...

Very true!!! - that's something that's been brought up during both trainings I've been to: participants know what to expect, whether they take the class in Manhattan or Tokyo. It's an individual experience shared on a global scale.

 Yes that is true, but i know what to expect in track 4 of attack as well.  but Lis does a great job of mixing up the the track 4's so that they are all a bit different.  think about just the track 4 of the 60's...  they all have thier own personality of chorey.   You cant really say that about track 6's.   and most of the threes and  8s as well.

I DO NOT WANT a class format change.  just dont want every track to have the same chorey as that last one.  Earlier i posted the chorey for future track 6's.   i havnt seen the chorey... but that IS what it will be most likely.  THAT....... is an issue.